Do You Need A Noun Descriptor?

Building a Coaching Culture - #110: Do You Need A Noun Descriptor? === J.R. Flatter [00:00:45]: Hey. Welcome back, everybody. Jrflatter here with my cohost, Lucas. Lucas Flatter [00:00:50]: Hello. J.R. Flatter [00:00:50]: How are you doing, Lucas? Pretty good. So today, we're gonna start talking about and this sounds a little bit academic, and I I mean it a bit tongue in cheek, do you need a noun descriptor in front of coaching? And so whether you're an entrepreneur and you're putting your coaching shingle out or you're an internal coach and you're coaching internally to your organization or your coach educators like you and I or we're both coaches, do you need the descriptor in front of your coaching? And there are literally infinite things one could say in front of coaching. I most often say and think and educate towards leadership coaching. Even that I hesitate and for multiple reasons. But in a global labor market, it's largely virtual, a crowded labor market because one of the realities of the coaching world is it's a relatively low bar to enter. You don't need anybody's permission to say you're a coach. There are coaching accreditations, and you and I align ourselves to the International Coaching Federation. But there are dozens of other paths one could take. J.R. Flatter [00:02:05]: Or just take your knowledge, skills, abilities, and experiences and and begin calling yourself a coach. And so in that crowded labor market, it's largely virtual in a social media world. You may very well need a noun descriptor to focus you and to break through that noise. What are your initial thoughts as we head down this path? Lucas Flatter [00:02:27]: Yeah. There's multiple factors. There's like, is your coaching going to be a different style or is it just the way that you're marketing yourself? For example, you know, like you could say I'm a programmer or a coach or, you know, I I coach people that are in the technical sphere. Do I coach them differently with that descriptor? Or is it more just the way that I target people by calling myself that? So that's one of the things that pops into my mind initially. J.R. Flatter [00:02:58]: Yeah. I'm glad you brought that up because I think and this is in in my mind's eye as I educate coaches and and as I practice coaching. You may very well need to market yourself in a particular niche to borrow from our friend Brian Elwood. But then, again, as a coach educator, coach unlabeled, and I'll explain myself. So one of the examples in Brian's book, Nail Your Niche, is focus on your intersection of genius until you become one of 1. Because there are 8,000,000,000 of us in the world, and you have limited capacity to communicate with them. Time and dollars and opportunity cost. And so you probably should and almost certainly need to create that intersection of genius that makes you one of 1. J.R. Flatter [00:03:53]: And if I remember correctly, he talks about a coach who only focuses on dental practices that have an interest in real estate, and so they're buying brick and mortar practices. So this particular coach coaches those people. And so that's a noun descriptor. I'm a real estate dental coach or whatever that individual might call themselves. But as a coach and as a coach educator, if that person were in my cohort, I would tell them, you will coach that demographic, but agnostically about who they are and what they're doing in the purest sense. And so the fundamentals of coaching, setting a baseline of the session and the relationship, adapting, supporting, responding, which are competencies 4, 5, and 6 from the International Coach Federation. And then evoking new awareness and creating growth, competencies 7 and 8, you do that agnostically as to whether they're a dentist and interested in real estate or not. And so in a marketing mindset as compared to a coaching mindset, I think you need a noun descriptor for the former and not so much for the latter. J.R. Flatter [00:05:14]: I don't know. What do you think? Lucas Flatter [00:05:16]: Yeah. It's like, this comes up all the time where it's like you've got your either statistical or, like, narrative around, like, this is what this group of people generally does or this is what they generally believe. But then you get in the room with an individual in that group and maybe, you know, they're a realtor, but they're ready to switch careers or they're only doing it for a different kind of motivation than the rest of the realtors? Or, you know, it's it's easy to think about something in a big picture setting. But then when you're speaking with an individual, you see how how different every every person can be. So I guess, yeah, I agree with you that it's it's more of like, this is how I'm communicating with many people. And then once I'm Mhmm. You know, speaking with one person, it's it's a little different. J.R. Flatter [00:06:11]: Yeah. You've just reminded me of 2 really important fundamentals of of coaching and working with human beings. In almost every session you and I have, you coach me. So you just reminded me of one of our bedrock fundamentals of coaching, and that is every session starts with a blank chalkboard and a blank table. Because if I am one of 1 in my niche, I've got my noun descriptor. When I walk into that coaching session, I better remove all presupposed outcomes Because I bet that real estate coach to dentist has preconceived outcomes of what a successful practice looks like. Like, here are 10 things you absolutely must do, and that's consulting and that's mentoring, but it's not coaching. And you and I talked at a recent episode about what are some of the obstacles to success. J.R. Flatter [00:07:08]: The obstacles for that individual human being, irrespective of their dentist and they're interested in building a practice with brick and mortar real estate, I better go into that coaching room with an open mind as to what the obstacles will be for that individual. Lucas Flatter [00:07:27]: I also, think about how these identities can shift over time too. It's like there's this joke. I don't know which comedian, but he was saying, like, I'm embarrassed by the Bob Marley poster that was on my wall when I was 15. Like, why would I, you know, get a tattoo? It's like, so think about you're creating all this marketing and maybe even, like, you know, physical materials and sending them out to people and changing your website. So I would say that, like, if you are going to have a descriptor, it should be something that's you're, you know, thinking about long term and that you're passionate about. I guess, personally, my example would be that, like, you know, I have these different skills, like programmer, cartooning, etcetera, coaching. But now as time go is going on, it's I'm thinking about that more in terms of, like, I'm a learner. I'm an educator. Lucas Flatter [00:08:23]: I'm not, like, any specific one of those things. So that's just something that comes up in my mind. J.R. Flatter [00:08:29]: No. That's a brilliant insight. And it goes back to our our previous comment about who is it and coaching them where they are, and then also helping them discover where do they want to be. And it may be a very different set of knowledge, skills, and abilities to get them to that aspiration. So that's one of the things we ask early on in a coaching relationship is what's your life all about and who do you wanna be personally and professionally? And as we've discussed in previous sessions, often times we get a blank stare or, you know, to go back to, stages of mourning. The first stage of mourning is always denial. There's no way I can think that far into the future is a common sentiment, but we help them discover that. That's part of the the fundamentals of coaching, part of competency 8. J.R. Flatter [00:09:21]: Evoking or creating new awareness is 7, but creating growth is 8. But it also goes back to one of the fundamentals of working with human beings. And I'll put my social scientist sat on for a minute and my statistical analyst hat. You can predict accurately for a group. So if I'm looking at a group of dentists who are interested in real estate and I had a 1,000 data points, I could probably predict accurately for those 1,000 people as a group. They're generally going to move in a particular direction and have particular behaviors. And this is what the the fundamentals of economics are. When you go read Econ 101 and and discuss supply and demand, if you have scarcity, it drives up costs. J.R. Flatter [00:10:12]: And, oh, by the way, everything is scarce. That's one of the fundamentals of economics. The same thing applies with human beings when we try to predict human behavior and human needs and desires. When you extrapolate, which means take from known data and predict to the future, to a individual human being, you're violating one of the fundamentals of statistical analysis of human beings. And it's because we have choice. Every human being has choice. And so you have a haircut. I have a haircut. J.R. Flatter [00:10:46]: They're very different. Even though we're father and son. You have a shirt on. I have a shirt on. There's a bit of blue in them, but they're very different. How you speak, how you behave, lot of similarities, but a lot of differences. That's just 2 data points across 8,000,000,000 humans. And so when you go back to this idea, do I need it now in descriptor? And do I bring that now in descriptor into the coaching room? It's back to a yes and a no. J.R. Flatter [00:11:13]: For marketing, sales, communication is a big part of your job as a coach is communicating the value of coaching before coaching starts. So in your communication strategy, you probably have 1 or 2 noun descriptors, 1 or 2 sentences on expected return on investment. Generally, and one thing you and I would strongly suggest at the intersection of personal and professional. But when you're in the coaching room, you're promising yourself and you're promising the leader you're going into that room with, we're gonna leave the noun descriptors on the table for now or even outside of the room for now. And if they were on the chalkboard when we left the last session, I erased them before you got here today. Absolutely critical to successful coaching. Lucas Flatter [00:12:05]: I also think about, like, somebody that's experienced versus somebody that's just coming into the profession. Like, maybe if you're, like, a rookie on the team, it's like, oh, he's he's good at, you know, rebounds. And so anytime we need somebody to do that particular job, we're gonna put him in. But maybe if he's been in the league for 10 years, it's like, you know, he's an all rounder. He's good at all these things or maybe he's one of the top 10 in the league. So I guess at the beginning, you're kinda telling the world who you are. Then later on, they're saying, oh, you know, he coached JR Flatter or he coached, you know, the CEO. And it's not about the descriptor anymore. Lucas Flatter [00:12:50]: It's like, you know, you've demonstrated success. J.R. Flatter [00:12:53]: Yeah. So one of the things that we teach, and this has been borne out in in demonstration across a 1,000 coaches or more, is we teach you will be able to coach anyone on any topic at any time from any culture if you use the fundamentals of coaching. And, again, going back to the competencies. Set a baseline for what you wanna accomplish together in this relationship with a session, adapt, support, respond, and and evoke new awareness and and facilitate growth. Nowhere in there does it say noun descriptor, culture, ethnicity, gender, age, preference, which I'm reminding myself of, you know, the difference between ethics and morality, but that's a topic for another day. Soapbox, I regularly get on to and which I think is quite necessary. So if you truly believe you have the ability to coach anyone at any time, at any place, on any topic, from any culture, You're gonna leave the noun descriptor outside of the room when you enter the room. If you truly believe this is a unique human being different from any of the other 8,000,000,000, you're gonna leave the now descriptor out of the room. J.R. Flatter [00:14:11]: Might be front and center on your website. Might be front and center on your flyer. It might be central to your agreement conversation. I tend to focus on leadership. I tend to focus on life. I tend to focus on health. And I've had this conversation with dozens and dozens of coaches who are entrepreneurs or coaching internal. It's okay to describe that. J.R. Flatter [00:14:36]: But as you enter the coaching room, both of you need to be equally aware of who am I and what are our expectations and outcomes. But even with that said, enter the coaching room with a blank chalkboard and an empty table. Lucas Flatter [00:14:52]: Yeah. I mean, yeah, we talk about, like, removing yourself from the situation. I guess, if you're getting too wrapped up in your noun descriptor and you kind of let yourself, like, what your idea of what kind of coach you are, if you let that affect your coaching, you're kind of inserting your own beliefs and yeah. Like we mentioned that you wanna come in fresh each time. So J.R. Flatter [00:15:19]: No. That's a brilliant observation. Yeah. You're you're jaundice ing the scope, and you're jaundice ing the outcome if you bring the noun descriptor into the room. But we're not talking about dental practice, so, therefore, we're not getting closer to your growth. We're not talking about real estate, therefore, we're not getting closer to your growth. But in the same sense, if you and I both come into the knowing that's our intended outcome, then no harm, no foul. But, again, I would ask you as a coach, leave the possibility open that this isn't about real estate and dentistry. J.R. Flatter [00:15:57]: It could be entirely about their work family self balance. It could be entirely about a challenge that they're working through known only to themselves, and maybe not even yet known to themselves, and you'll help them discover. So you have to leave those fundamental possibilities in the realm of the possible to really maximize your coaching. If not, if you have a checklist that says either the 10 things you must do to be a successful real estate developer in dental practices. And don't call yourself a coach. Not right or wrong, not judgmental, but you're a consultant at that point and a valuable contributor to business. But you're not a coach, And that's not good, bad, or indifferent. It just is. Lucas Flatter [00:16:46]: I guess, the only other thing that comes to mind for me is, like, what if, you know, I just I wanna help this particular group of people, you know, like, that's my goal is to help, you know, single mothers or, you know, even comedians or whatever whatever group of people. J.R. Flatter [00:17:07]: Starving cartoonists. Lucas Flatter [00:17:08]: Yeah. Exactly. So I guess in that case, there's a difference between, like, you know, maybe I adjust my messaging and I end up targeting a completely different group. For some people, that's okay. And, you know, maybe they start leaning into that new group. But for others, it's like, oh, I missed the mark. You know? J.R. Flatter [00:17:26]: Yeah. There's a couple of thoughts that come to mind when I hear you say that. And one of them is from a very, very practical perspective, and another is from a very personal perspective. And I'll try to remember practical and personal. Practically, the market's gonna tell you, is there sufficient need and desire in the marketplace? And I learned this from your brother. Pick your niche, drive your boat into the shore, and see what the market tells you. And if your boat doesn't fill with goods and services, then drive back out to sea and rethink. Did I too narrowly niche? Is my communication not clear enough, strong enough? Or do I need to pick another market because maybe I'm not passionate enough about this particular market? I thought I was. J.R. Flatter [00:18:19]: But you have the opportunity just like the leader has an opportunity to change. You know, your analogy of when you were 15 versus now in your thirties of how different you are. You had the opportunity to change, and so does the leader, but so do you as a coach. Now as recently as last night, I updated my LinkedIn profile to say who I think I am now versus who I thought I was even a year ago. And I always have this hint of remorse when I do that thinking, dang, I can't make up my mind about who I am. But it's a refinement. It's not a complete 180 degree turn. I continue to refine. J.R. Flatter [00:18:59]: And part of that goes back to yours and not our methodology of being lifelong learners and being in a lifelong journey of growth. Growth through refinement. And so you as a coach get that opportunity to continue refining, but you do have the opportunity to coach those who energize you. And so you very much might need a noun descriptor as you gather people to coach. And, you know, you and I have never talked about it, but the average coach has a dozen or so leaders in their cohort at any given time. And so you're only really looking for 12 people out of 8,000,000,000 or thereabouts, and you have to resupply the pipeline, obviously. So that's another part of the businesses. Coaching is only a third, and then finding new people to coach is another third, and then administering the practice is the final third. J.R. Flatter [00:19:52]: So you deserve to coach someone who energizes you. Now your mortgage might still have a little bit to say about that, and your significant other in your life might have something to say about that. And those are important contributors to your decisions. But you have a lot to say about who you choose to coach. When I started this business 22 years ago, I had a very clear idea of what I wanted to accomplish with it. But life happened, and I needed to pay the bills and send you and your siblings to college, continue to travel and enjoy life. And so the business became something very different than I had initially anticipated, but I was quite happy with that. So there are compromises. J.R. Flatter [00:20:36]: I tend to be a bit of an idealist. We tend to teach from an idealistic viewpoint, this clean, sterile academic view. But when you put, as Jurg said earlier, the rubber on the road, the market will tell you, your passion will tell you, the leaders that you're working with will tell you, do I need to define and refine my noun descriptor? Lucas Flatter [00:21:01]: Yeah. I mean, I think that's a great way to wrap it up is think about who do you want to coach. You know, are you attracting the people that, you know, you're getting energized by, that you feel like you're making those connections? And, you know, adjusting if you're you know, you had one idea. Like, we talk about idealism, but idealism mixed with realism. Like, you know, it's like, I don't think I didn't think when I was a kid I'd be doing this particular job, but I wanted to be happy and I wanted to have my family around me and, you know, being able to, you know, enjoy any client in any particular niche is also part of that idealism. But, you know, there's things that you can adjust and reach for to find that audience, I think. J.R. Flatter [00:21:50]: Yeah. And you're talking you're touching on one of my favorite topics, and that's the idea of being unreasonable. You know, we get a lot of pushback on that characteristic. This is another topic for another session. But as each of you are growing up, whether I ever said it out loud or not, I wanted you to be a bit unreasonable on your expectations of what life had to offer. And although the 6 of us grew up in the same house, your mother and I and your 3 siblings and you, you're all magnificently different. And as your father and your mother, we chose purposely debate to for you to be positively unreasonable about your expectations of what it meant to be a a human being and what it meant to be part of a family. So now here you are, cartoonist, computer scientist, guitar player, father in a very different way, husband in a very different way, but there's a lot of beauty in that. J.R. Flatter [00:22:52]: Yeah. Good session. Lucas Flatter [00:22:53]: That conversation. Thanks. J.R. Flatter [00:22:55]: Talk to you soon. Well, that concludes this episode of building a coaching culture. I truly hope that this episode was helpful to you. If it was, be sure to follow us wherever you listen to podcasts. Maybe stop and give us a rating or a review and share this podcast with someone who might find it helpful as well. Thanks again, and we'll see you next time.